Say Goodbye to Hearing Aids with Mobbins Magic Sp Ear

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Mobbins magic sp ear

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Thread: Thunder Spear vs. Magic Composition

Astuun: get Ice Strike ASAP. It's a mob skill, does more damage than Thundderbolt, has a greater vertical range and it freezes. Ice Strike is a must for all I/L mages, so get it first.

Pfft, getting 3 attacks seems too much. I haven't decided my my 3rd job build, but I'll max IS, Compo, Amp and at least lvl11 booster. So it seems TS won't be used at all.
I'm lucky half my guild are I/L mage that will be lvl1xx before me, so I'll know first hand what skills are the best for me.

5th July 2007, 10:08 PM #13 Drake Join Date Nov 2006 Location IN NURI'S FACTORY MOOCHIN HER PIES Posts 713 Originally Posted by au2k5

no t-spear builds fail

chain lightning, while it is a good skill, it will not be a primary skill, you need to get as much ice demon and ifrit as you can, it puts out more dmg, and give you better control. but that aint the topic, lol.

i've been using thunder spear almost EVERYWHERE i trained, including gobies, it does help you train faster, any experienced ice mage should know this. (however, it is hard to utilize this if you dont know much about what you're training on)

if you're gonna get slow, get it over with in second job. period.

did i miss anything? o.O

Just because it isn't what you did doesn't mean that it "fails." I understand that you're far more experienced than me (or anyone else in here), but I think you're rather jaded by many levels of training beyond the intentions of our current content. Try to keep in mind that not everyone else here (in fact probably no one) will be training as far past 120 without their 4th job skills as you have.

-Maple Hiatus- Playing WoW at least until 4th job comes out

Frozenstein- 70 Mage on Altar of Storms.
Look me up if you wanna play!

5th July 2007, 10:12 PM #14 Slime Join Date Sep 2006 Location The Ghetto/Projects in Rhode Island Posts 60

From my experience I say Thunder Spear. At higher levels it will be slower then Comp of course but the damage will out class the speed of the cast. In the long run an Ice Strike / Comp combination is a lot more usefull. More usefull for both boss and exp(Per hour) situations.

Takiri - Valefor server - Final Fantasy XI for life.

TheOnePirate - Windia - Semi.Active

PermaNewbTak - Windia - Active

5th July 2007, 10:28 PM #15 Drake Join Date Nov 2006 Location IN NURI'S FACTORY MOOCHIN HER PIES Posts 713 Originally Posted by takiri

From my experience I say Thunder Spear. At higher levels it will be slower then Comp of course but the damage will out class the speed of the cast.

Actually, it won't out class the speed in most typical cases (see math).

Originally Posted by takiri

In the long run an Ice Strike / Comp combination is a lot more usefull. More usefull for both boss and exp(Per hour) situations.

You seem to take the opposite position here. The original poster was debating to get either compo or TS. Unless in the first part you meant you recommend getting both attacks, and here you're saying "if you have to choose between the two, get Compo."

-Maple Hiatus- Playing WoW at least until 4th job comes out

Frozenstein- 70 Mage on Altar of Storms.
Look me up if you wanna play!

6th July 2007, 12:35 AM #16 Drake Join Date Oct 2005 Location bronx NY Posts 996

im not bashing your build. its my opinion that the build fails, yes. but you're entitled to build your char any which way you want. im not shunting you for it. dont take it so serious >.> im always straightforward with my opinions.

6th July 2007, 03:29 AM #17 Slime Join Date Apr 2006 Location Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Posts 73
Spear, I regret putting Magic Comp onto my mage. Spear all the way!

5X Cleric (Lol Bellocan)
10X Ice/Lightning Wizard (Scania)
9X Dragon Knight (Broa)

11th July 2007, 02:39 PM #18 Beginner Join Date Aug 2006 Posts 38

Maybe for some skiping ts , fail in end, but personnaly I do belive it's the best way to go. Yeah TS will be usefull as a finisher and on viking, that might save you some second but you have to sacrifise booster or seal to get it. Personnaly the advantage you got from (max booster + max seal + max pr) are much better then the advantage you get from max TS.

By maxing Ts you might:

-only have 11 booster and that will make you loose plenty of second as you gonna need to cast it more often, also having 20 booster is awesome for timing with med, making it easier to cast it on rope to avoid time lost.

-only have 10 seal, and before you reach 800 matk, having it max will be awesome to regroup monster faster. With 10 seal you gonna have to cast it way more often then max one, making you loose time. Havin seal max make you much more effective in party and it'll help you alot lvling lvl 100 to 13x. Seal is a 3rd job skill and it'll help you good to get through 3rd job.

-only have 1 in partial resist. Most ppl say 1 is far enough, but having it max is just better. It'll save you pot at boss.

Compo will be your most effective training skill. TS might be better on lit weak, but freeze kind of make it(I need 5 compo for viking, while I would need 4 ts). On ice resist monster ts might be better, but we talking of training effective.

As for pap, TS might kb much sooner, but at higher lvl compo will also kb, making it your main attacking skill at pap. Having max slow, will allow you to be effective at pap, even if you dont kb it, slow will make it almost impossible for you or your party to get corner. You'll also kill it faster as compo do more dammager over time then ts.

TS might be a good finisher but it'll take a while before you get the advantage off it, as you gonna need over 800 matk. You gonna have to figure perfectly when use it, else you'll end spending more time to kill the enemy.

As I see it, skiping TS guive you much more advantage at lower lvl that u'll still have at later lvl, while having TS max guive you a bit of boost at really late lvl.

12th July 2007, 08:47 PM #19 Banned Join Date Jul 2006 Posts 4,895

Although all this seems very interesting and all your ideas are fairly genuine and insightful, I'd still like to know where a non-TS i/l mage would train. I recently hit 85 (86 today) and I was worried whether TS first is a bad idea, but I rather like viking training.

I know I'm too weak for squids/gobys at the moment and I don't see how compo would help more than TS - if anything, at least you can all agree that on a per hit basis, TS is stronger than compo, and that's much more useful at squids, to me, than a freezing effect (something which I can do with 2 other faster spells, one of which mobs).

12th July 2007, 09:56 PM #20 Drake Join Date Nov 2006 Location IN NURI'S FACTORY MOOCHIN HER PIES Posts 713 Originally Posted by ElderDragon

Although all this seems very interesting and all your ideas are fairly genuine and insightful, I'd still like to know where a non-TS i/l mage would train. I recently hit 85 (86 today) and I was worried whether TS first is a bad idea, but I rather like viking training.

I know I'm too weak for squids/gobys at the moment and I don't see how compo would help more than TS - if anything, at least you can all agree that on a per hit basis, TS is stronger than compo, and that's much more useful at squids, to me, than a freezing effect (something which I can do with 2 other faster spells, one of which mobs).

Squids are strong to lightning, so TS wouldn't really help you there (except maybe to dispose of the few black squids that spawn if you're on top or mid). For an individual hit, TS certainly does more damage than Compo. But if you'll look at the numbers, compo will outdamage TS over time on an element neutral monster.

Compo is not very useful for squids either (again because they're lightning-strong). If you'll look at those numbers again, cold beam will actually be better. Compo can be used to kill the black squids, but it is not at all essential for squid training since you'll be mobbing with Ice Strike the vast majority of the time. That is why I wouldn't recommend getting it until you've got your more useful training skills (Ice Strike, Booster, Amp, possibly even Seal (in that order)). If one were to follow the Ice Strike->11 booster (1 seal in there somewhere)->Amp->Compo path, he would get Compo maxed by lvl104, just in time to start going to bosses.

Where will a no-TS mage train? After death teddies (around 83 or so), do deep sea gorge 1 (bonefish + gobies) until about 87, when you can start squids. Start joining squid parties at 92, and do this until whenever you feel like stopping- I did em up till like 110 and still do squid occasionally. But at this point, gobies are the best option. The argument has been made that TS does help speed up goby training a bit (used as a finishing move to finish off a bonefish you weren't mobbing), but it is certainly not essential.

The key is to remember that in all your training, mobbing > single attacking. Mages by far have the worst damage output of all classes over time against single monsters (I haven't run the numbers, but just observationally). The only thing that allows us to keep on par with them is the ability for mobbing and crowd control.

-Maple Hiatus- Playing WoW at least until 4th job comes out

Frozenstein- 70 Mage on Altar of Storms.
Look me up if you wanna play!

no t-spear builds fail
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